“Opera conducting is more spontaneous than orchestral conducting”
For the first time in his career, the famous conductor Kirill Karabits turned to Igor Stravinsky as a conductor-producer of “The Rake’s Progress.” Under his musical direction and directed by Vidar Magnussen, the opera appeared on the stage of the National Opera and Ballet Theater in Oslo. About Stravinsky's score, his attitude to modern directing and the combination of symphonic performances with opera Kirill Karabits told Vladimir Dudin.
— What turned out to be the most important for you in the performing sense in “The Rake’s Progress”?
— To be honest, I came here in suspense, not really understanding how to behave with this opera. It was clear that its sound should be Mozartian, transparent, but what to do with the dissonant filling - hide it or, conversely, pull it to the fore, make something out of it? But all my fears dissolved, which was helped by the music itself, everything began to play on its own, started spinning, the problem disappeared by itself.
There is a recording of Gardiner’s “The Rake” (British conductor John Eliot Gardiner.— "Kommersant"), where everything is perfectionistically precise, but rather dry and empty. And there is a “non-empty” recording of Nagano (Japanese conductor Kent Nagano.— "Kommersant"), where, on the contrary, there is a lack of transparency and subtlety. There is so much mixed in this music by Stravinsky, like a mosaic, a patchwork, sewn from pieces, squares, circles, which as a whole add up to genius. For him, writing a tragedy so that everyone sheds tears at once is too primitive, so he hides it under several layers of different things that need to be extracted from there. There are moments when I get chills, especially when he gets to the topic of eternity, God's judgment, repentance. This is Faust and Mephistopheles mixed with Don Juan and the Commander. Stravinsky continues The Story of a Soldier, deepening and expanding it. One feels that he is cramped in tonality, he does whatever he wants with the harmonies, as in “The Rite of Spring,” where major and minor sound simultaneously in the chord chains. This gives a breathing effect, takes us beyond the primitive division into cheerful and sad. And this is, in fact, Mozart, whose most tragic moments are often written in a major key.
“The setting of this Rake’s Progress is reminiscent of the modern houses of the area located next to the Oslo Opera House. Did the director transfer the events of the morality play to the present day?
— Yes, the scenery is really similar to this area, not far from where I live now. This opera by Stravinsky is little known in Norway, but people here discover it with pleasure. The director is a pleasant and likeable person, a very famous comic actor here, he came up with a lot of funny things without violating the meaning of the libretto. It seemed to me that opera here is classified more as an entertainment genre that is supposed to make fun. In general, the director proceeded from semantic minimalism; during rehearsals he did not dictate anything to the singers, did not indicate what to do, and always offered to try.
— Did you find any responsive singers?
— The singers were excellent. This is the performer of the title role, Thomas Atkins from New Zealand, living in England, whom I know from the Glyndebourne Festival. And the Norwegian soloists Marie Eriksmoen (Ann Truelove) and Alexander Noor (Nick Shadow), who did an incredible job of learning the new score, I was very pleased with them. During rehearsals they improvised a lot, based on their instincts and knowledge of the libretto. And the director watched them, corrected them, recording what he liked. To be honest, I liked this method because it didn’t pressure me with concepts, rethinking, or discovering third meanings. Although there was a certain assumption that the events of the play take place as if in Tom’s dream, in the mode of a half-fairy tale, in which there was a real devil with horns - Nick Shadow. The topic is not new, but the director revealed it in his own way, reminding us once again of something that everyone knows about. I can’t help but appreciate another of his important, invaluable qualities today: he did not interfere with the conductor. The main tension in modern performances arises, as a rule, from the director's inventions, which often do not allow the music to take place; all efforts are spent on tying up loose ends so that everything sounds more or less similar to how it is written.
— How long did you rehearse?
— Yes, I’ve been working in Oslo since August, I went only for a week to conduct the last concert of the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra at the BBC Proms. The program included Tchaikovsky's Fifth, Fyodor Akimenko's Angel, a concert by Jennifer Higdon with soloist Evelyn Glennie, and a miniature by Iranian female composer Nilufar Nourbakhsh, Knell, commissioned for the Nobel Peace Prize ceremony.
— Is it sad to part with the Bournemouth Orchestra?
- Well, of course, after all, I spent 15 years of my life there, during which time the relationship became very strong, there was mutual pleasure in communication. Working with them gave me the opportunity for self-realization that was not possible in other places. In terms of programs and repertoire, we entered the territory of modern music, thanks to which in the south of England we learned a lot of things that we had no idea about - for example, about Armenia, Avet Terteryan, Kara Karaev, musical phenomena that were incredible to them.
— But you combined leading an orchestra with working in the opera. Is this important?
- Yes. Over the past 15 years there have been and remain many theaters. In Europe, these are the Geneva and Zurich operas, Glyndebourne, An der Wien, Strasbourg, Weimar. I always felt very good at the opera. If everything goes well for the conductor in the opera house, and a general energy arises, you get a deeper pleasure than from a symphony orchestra. In an orchestra you can deeply explore some nuances, where the process is more controlled, but in opera, where many people are involved, everything depends on many moments and unforeseen circumstances. Opera conducting is more spontaneous than orchestral conducting, and this has always fascinated me. It’s just that to do this you need to be well “used” to the theater in order to understand the processes, to have an emotional connection with people, as a result of which some miracles arise.
— What are your plans after Oslo?
- Everything remains as it was, but I would like to breathe a little, understand what I would like to do next. Not so much what, but where, so now I’m taking a closer look. I would like to develop what already existed, but in a new, even more interesting, richer way. With orchestras it’s like with a person: there must be an invisible spark, and for this something must happen in the air. As soon as you start trying to control, everything becomes uncontrollable. But I’m looking at everything very carefully now. In 2026, I can expect Tchaikovsky’s Queen of Spades at the Deutsche Oper, La Traviata in Bregenz in 2025, and La Clemenza di Titus in Nice, where I dreamed of conducting this opera.
